Interesting Debate Over at the RGI (Part II)


Remember when I said that in all my interactions with the Race Grievance Industry, they constantly accused me of denying the very existence of white racism? Even though I took great pains to declare that I know full well that white racism does exist. It’s simply not a big problem in American anymore. Well, an interesting exchange happened over at Brotha Wolf’s place recently (here), in which a certain commenter — one “flyonthewall” — debated with Brotha Wolf (BW) and his acolytes. Frankly, fly mopped up the floor — and the walls, ceilings, cellar and two bathrooms — with BW, which led, as it inevitably does, to BW’s banning fly from commenting on his blog.

I know that such banning is inevitable, because a colleague of mine has been the bemused recipient of the same treatment in the past. She engaged BW and his acolytes and did the same mopping up as flyonthewall did. As a result, of course, BW banned her.

Can you imagine that? Banning someone from your blog? I find that unbelievable. I would think that someone who holds beliefs that are important to him or her would welcome challenges!

Nope. Not on the left. The “ideas” of the left are the sclerotic, ossified, weak, brittle, calcified, dessicated, mummified , long-discredited thinking of the ’60’s and ’70’s. But, that doesn’t mean that the holders of this same sad-sack thinking don’t hold onto it with passion, dedication and blind devotion. They are nothing if not fanatically devoted to their old reactionary thoughts.

Well, flyonthewall went on over to BW’s place and infected it with some fresh, commonsensical thinking, which led fairly promptly, of course, to his being banned. However, he did get in some great rhetorical blows that turned poor BW’s arguments into mush on the floor. It was fun to read, and I hope you’ll enjoy following it, below, as much as I did. I’ve added some commentary [in square brackets in red font] in line with the post and subsequent comments.


< ——– BEGINNING OF BROTHA WOLF’S POST AND SUBSEQUENT COMMENTS ——– >

Racism Exists

[Editor’s note: Remember when I said that BW can’t seem to admit that no one denies this? Despite literally dozens, possibly hundreds, of times his interlocutors and I have told him that, yes, racism exists. Now, BW has written an entire post arguing against a point that no one I know of has ever tried to make. ]

“You just have to face it, there just aren’t that many racist incidents against us black people to justify saying that it’s a racist country.”

But then, this person challenged me and my readers to “prove” that racism is still alive and well. However, I have a feeling that doing so will be useless. The problem is trying to convince naysayers that racism exists. Yet, many of those who ask for “proof” will reject it usually as part of the leftist plot of trying to guilt trip white people and trick black folks into thinking that racism is still here when, in their minds, it isn’t. [Editor’s note: so, to date — and I’ve been dealing on-and-off with BW for more than three years now, while flyonthewall is new to this — BW has offered nothing by way of proof, except non-credible, easily impeachable sources. Sources not quite as bad as, say, Al Sharpton, but close enough.]

Well, I shall attempt to show that racism is still alive and well with a few examples. Yes, I will call their bluff and dish out proof that this country’s still heavily racist. Though I know the obvious argument is that it came from the left.

  • Black teens are 21 times more likely to be killed by a cop than white ones. With the ongoing police shootings and killings of black people, it’s a safe bet that this study nails the truth that black people seem scary to cops. [Editor’s note: Obviously BW didn’t read this study. If he had, he might have noticed the little tidbit that said: “Still, lots of the reporting police departments are in larger cities” where blacks are a much larger percentage of the population. More: in the cities, much more violent crime is committed by blacks than whites. More to the point: the fact that black teens are “21 times more likely to be killed by a cop than white ones” is perfectly meaningless without knowing the extent to which black teens are more or less likely to be committing a crime. The proPublica article does not provide this vital piece of information.]
  • A study by the University of Chicago have found that employers are more hesitant to check out applicants with black-sounding names. To put it simply, ‘Amber’ and ‘John’ are more likely to be screened for jobs as opposed to ‘Lakeisha’ and ‘Deshawn’. [Editor’s note: Again, BW is ignorant of the facts behind this little study too. If he were to dig further, he would find out that blacks are vastly more likely to cause expensive problems in any company. They file more HR complaints, more complaints of racism or other HR-related issues. Issues that sometimes require expensive litigation. It is well-known in HR circles that hiring a black man or woman brings a lot more risk with it than hiring a white man or woman. Again, this is just a statistic. Women file more HR claims too. In fact, HR claims involving allegations of race or sex discrimination consistently account for more than 60% of all HR issues every year. (Source: here) HR claims that have to be litigated or settled are expensive. ]
  • The racial empathy gap demonstrates that people are mostly likely to feel empathize with pain and sympathy for white people than blacks as many people associate black skin with evilness and invulnerability. [Editor’s note: This is a study that purports to prove that white people don’t feel the pain of black people. If you read it, the methodology seems okay, if odd. However, you will notice something in this key paragraph from the piece:

For many people, race does matter, even if they don’t know it. They feel more empathy when they see white skin pierced than black. This is known as the racial empathy gap. To study it, researchers at the University of Milano-Bicocca showed participants (all of whom were white) video clips of a needle or an eraser touching someone’s skin. They measured participants’ reactions through skin conductance tests—basically whether their hands got sweaty—which reflect activity in the pain matrix of the brain. If we see someone in pain, it triggers the same network in our brains that’s activated when we are hurt. But people do not respond to the pain of others equally. In this experiment, when viewers saw white people receiving a painful stimulus, they responded more dramatically than they did for black people. Blue emphasis mine. Ummmm…so what happened to studying other races in just the same way? If this kind of reaction is common to all people of all races, then it’s nothing unusual in the white race. This study measured the reactions of only white people in reacting to only black people? It’s a rubbish study, whose findings — absent the understanding of the reactions of all races to all other races — are perfectly meaningless. What if black people reacted even less empathetically to the pain of white people? Would the study authors conclude that blacks were more racist? Or would that be white people’s fault too? What if Chinese people reacted less empathetically to the pain of everyone? ]

  • Research has found that college professors favor white male students over everyone else. [Editor’s note: If you read this, you’ll see that the essay — a piece at http://www.npr.org (the infamous National Public Radio! A pet target of ours here at TPWG! NPR’s “news” is not news, because generally it’s so distorted that, as I’ve often said, “You come out of an NPR “news” broadcast less informed than you went in.”)]
  • Blacks are paid less for the same jobs compared to whites. [BW offers no source here, but I did find this: Research Brief Public Policy Institute of CaliforniaIt’s a bit dated, but has some important information that I suspect has only become more true in the intervening years. It says, for example, this: “if Hispanic workers had the same education levels as white workers, their relative wages would be substantially higher than they are now: 93 cents per dollar for both men and women (see Figure 2). If Hispanics also worked in the same occupations as whites, their wages would be comparable to those of white workers. ” And, it says this: “On average, African American workers also have less education than white workers and are more likely to work in lower-paying occupations. However, if African American workers had the same education levels as white workers, their relative wages would improve by only a few cents per dollar. If they also worked in the same occupations as whites, their relative wages would improve more substantially, to 84 cents per dollar for men and 95 cents per dollar for women.” In other words: the actual reasons for the wage gap that BW’s talking about — at least in California — is because Hispanics and blacks are (1) less educated, and (2) work in fields that pay less. ]
  • Research has shown that people, regardless of race, tend to trust white faces over black faces. [Editor’s note: Well, I read the article. Its first paragraph puts enough doubt into its conclusions that you are forced to admit that you can draw no conclusions from it. Here’s that first paragraph:

“Psychologists have found that people may make economic and trust decisions based on unconscious or unintentional racial biases.”

“May make?” Okay. That means that they may not make such decisions based oin unconscious or unintentional bias too. 

The article continues with this: “The researchers found that the participants’ implicit race attitudes, measured in a subsequent test, predicted disparities in the perceived trustworthiness of Black and White faces. Individuals whose tests demonstrated a stronger pro-White implicit bias were more likely to judge White faces as more trustworthy than Black faces, and vice versa, regardless of that individual’s own race or explicit beliefs.” In other words, 

“While the study’s subjects in both experiments included multiple racial groups, the race of the participants did not account for the findings.

And:

There is not a simple correspondence between individuals’ implicit racial attitudes and their own race,” the researchers explained. “Implicit attitudes are thought to result from many sources beyond one’s own race, including environmental exposure and personal interactions.” (emphasis mine).

So, according to BW, who pointed me to this article, even black people trust white faces more than black faces, and it’s because of environmental exposure and personal interactions! In other words, black people’s personal interactions with white people lead them to trust white faces more than black faces! BW really doesn’t want to use this publication to try to support his point of view! Lol! 🙂 ]

  • Blacks and Hispanics of higher classes will still live in poorer communities than whites with working class incomes. [Editor’s note: Okay. What does this mean? doesn’t pass the “So What” test.]
  • There’s a gap in income and wealth between whites and nonwhites. [Editor’s note: Duh! However, there’s no gap in income between any race if you look at the children of families where the father and mother were married and stayed married. As I hinted at here, (and flyonthewall said here) that’s just not possible in a racist country. ]

For more information, check out the following pages:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/02/civil-rights-act-anniversary-racism-charts_n_5521104.html

http://listcrux.com/top-10-reasons-why-racism-still-exists/

http://www.cracked.com/article_21822_5-studies-that-prove-racism-still-way-worse-than-we-think.html [Editor’s note: I didn’t bother to read these. It was obvious that the other sources that BW used are not going to support his positions, there’s no reason to suppose that HuffPo or listcrux.com or cracked.com is going to shed any real light on the topic. at least not in support of BW’s position!]

As you or anyone can see, racism, is still an American pastime. [Editor’s note: for some, but not for many, and certainly not for anyone who’s been paying attention at all for the past few decades.] In fact, in most cases it’s business as usual, business which benefits white people as a whole. [Editor’s note: Is BW really trying to pretend that nothing’s changed in America in the past few decades? If so, then he’s just a complete moron. Or, as he’s admitted, he’s a racist himself. ] Regardless, another part of racism is to deny that racism exists. [Editor’s note: thank goodness, this doesn’t happen then. 🙂 However, I should note, that “denying that racism exists” is not, obviously, racism. It’s simply an opinion based on whatever the dude or dudette who holds it has used to formulate it. Duh!] Despite overwhelming, indisputable evidence conducted by studies by this nation’s universities and colleges, there will always be those who refuse to see the truth in front of their faces. [Editor’s note: Then, BW should produce some of this “overwhelming, indisputable evidence,” instead of the studies and articles and pieces and features that all seem to prove my point (and that of flyonthewall) rather than his!]

  1. You can pull all the stats, studies and they still will argue the contrary. You know why? Because deep down, they know they are racist. Instead of trying to recognize it and run interference on it when it arises, they deny, deny, deny. That’s why it is useless to argue or debate with them. [Editor’s note: Typical Herneith: drive-by snark, without substance or backup or facts or evidence or anything that actually addresses the topic at hand.]

  2. You will also get the kerchief head clowns joining the white halleluiah chorus. [Editor’s note: Huh?] Contorting yourself in order to conform to white expectations(ones they don’t even follow themselves), is an exercise in futility to say the least. These shuck and jive artists don’t realize that black folk aren’t monolithic. [Editor’s note: Yet as soon as you disagree with any of them,  you instantly get excommunicated, called a white man, a liar and all sorts of other things. What Herneith can’t figure out, because, I suspect, she has a brain the size of a pea, is that she is always saying that blacks are completely monolithic.] They are not sitting around blaming ‘whitey’ for everything that is wrong in their lives, if any. [Editor’s note: Oh? Do tell. Some evidence, please.] However, discussing white supremacy and its’ deleterious effects ,and realizing how it works goes a long way in promoting mental and physical health. [Editor’s note: Huh?] Where do they think many of these ‘pathologies’ came from to start? The ‘I’m doing well, why aren’t the other blacks’? meme doesn’t hold any water. But then again, they aren’t like those worthless Negroes are they? They are the new ‘black’. Another futile group of assholes it isn’t worth ‘debating’ with. [Editor’s note: Huh?] They are suffering from Stockholm syndrome, an appropriate term given their love of white behind kissing. They, like their white racist/supremacist counterparts only deserve derision. [Editor’s note: Here is a woman overtly blaming flyonthewall’s prosperity on “Stockholm Syndrome.” Fly, predictably, bats this out of the park.]

  3. flyonthewallsaid:

    April 3, 2015 at 5:06 am

    Lol! BW, this was a wasted post. No one, myself included, ever said that white racism doesn’t exist.

    These are the indisputable FACTS, though: (1) White racism is WAY less than you think it is. It exists, but it’s not a big problem anymore (2) OUR racism, black racism, is a lot MORE than you are willing to admit. It IS a big problem. We need to admit that and stop it. (3) I said in another post that the differences in economic achievement between the races DISAPPEAR when two-parent families remain intact. You and I both know that would be impossible in a racist country. No one here addressed that, except to call me a liar, a white man, delusional and other nonsense.

    • flyonthewallsaid:

      April 3, 2015 at 5:14 am

      Herneith, you said that black people are not monolithic, yet as soon as I disagreed with Brotha Wolf, I was accused of being a liar and white.

      You say that I’m a victim of Stockholm syndrome. I earn a very, VERY good living. I grew up poor, and took advantage of a completely free education, and have a great job that pays me well into six figures. Some abuse! Some oppression! You implied that I’m worthless, but I’m actually worth a tad north of $2 million. [Editor’s note: Ouch! Pow! Fly makes a pretty good point. Apparently, Herneith’s version of “Stockholm Syndome” is when whitey allows the black dude to get rich! Lololololololll!!!]

      If my “white racist supremacist overlords” are so abusing me, they’re doing it by making me rich. Pretty rotten of them, eh? I sure hope they continue to abuse me in exactly the same way. I’ll hope that in my summer home, and in my nice boat, and in the nice little condo I’m thinking of buying in the Caribbean for the odd weekend getaway with my wife and kids. [Editor’s note: Pow! Herneith made no further reply.]

  4. *YAWN* Here we go again…troll-feeding.

    Statistics don’t mean a damned thing to those cretins who demand them. [Editor’s note: Well, I guess we’ll never know, since flyonthewall was the only one to provide any statistics!] Such persons also cherry-pick the personal experiences of others; if your experience confirms their bias, they will believe it – if it doesn’t, they won’t. [Editor’s note: This is obviously untrue. There is no need to “cherry pick” through the statistics. There are a plethora of them that support fly’s point-of-view. ]

    Just give them the ban-hammer and let them run back to Stormfront! [Editor’s note: In other words: “just shut ’em up ’cause I got nothin’ to counter what he’s sayin’.]

  5. flyonthewallsaid:

    April 3, 2015 at 4:49 pm

    @sepultura13, are you just another one who can’t answer the question? Can you tell me why all differences in economic achievement between races DISAPPEAR completely, when a two-parent family remains intact? I gave the source in another post. What you said about confirmation bias is apparently YOUR problem, not mine. I had to go AGAINST everything I was told to become successful. Maybe you should try thinking independently, instead of engaging in mindless name-calling. [Editor’s note: Flyonthewall is nothing if not persistent! I wish him luck! The RGI has a lot of emotional and financial well-being invested in the fraud that white racism is all over the place. ]

  6. Flyonthewall, you asked for proof. I gave it to you. And yet, you still reject it. I had enough of this. You are banned from my den. [Editor’s note: Aaaaaaannnnd, out comes the ban! 🙂 Wow! BW sure must have the courage of his convictions, eh?!? After all, only a man truly confident of his beliefs would permit no opposing viewpoints. As I might have mentioned: BW is nothing but a sheep in wolf’s clothing. 🙂 ]

  7. flyonthewallsaid:

    April 3, 2015 at 10:01 pm

    Are you serious?!? I rejected nothing.

    I haven’t had a chance to respond to your post! Do you just want me to toss back a response, or do you want me to READ your links?

    You provided something like a dozen links. Do you think I’m going to have an instant response for you?

    So, I do you the HONOR of reading what you post carefully, and you ban me? You’re kidding, right?!?

    How does not responding in the timeframe you apparently arbitrarily decided on constitute “rejection” of your premise? If you have any integrity whatsoever, you will take back your silly ban, and abandon the idea of banning ANYONE in the future. It’s the coward’s way out, and it’s unworthy of someone who pretends to have a point of view that he holds dear. [Editor’s note: Bam!!! Don’t tick off the fly! Not sure how this post even appeared, though… I thought the fly was banned.]

    If your point of view is so fragile that it can’t stand a little challenge here and there, then you obviously don’t believe what you say, or are completely insecure in your beliefs. Again, if you have any integrity whatsoever, you will take back your silly ban. [Editor’s note: Bam again!]

    • I can take a challenge. [Editor’s note: Apparently not.] I accepted yours and presented evidence. [Editor’s note: And I just reviewed his “evidence.” It proves my points more than BW’s. I await flyonthewall’s response to the same “evidence.” If, that is BW doesn’t ban him. “Banning” — the coward’s way out.] You’re the one who can’t handle my point of view. It’s evidenced in your responses. And let’s be honest, nothing, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING you said was new, [Oh? the “marriage” thing was new. The study that produced the “marriage” conclusions is new. Yep. It’s new. ] as I heard it a million and one times before. [Editor’s note: Nope. You never heard the marriage thing. It’s brandy new.] I can respect your POV, [Editor’s note: Uhhhhh…no, apparently he can’t] but you’ve constantly disrespected mine and turned this into a topic about you, black crime and how much you like white people. So, goodbye because your kind of small-minded thinking and house negro ass [Editor’s note: Did BW really call flyonthewall a “house negro?” Wow! What a dirtbag! Fly did mention that he got pretty ticked off at that when it happened before!] kissing is no longer allowed here. Adios.

      • flyonthewallsaid:

        April 3, 2015 at 10:57 pm

        So, you prevent me from responding, then berate me for not responding? Are you serious? [Editor’s note: Uhhhhh…yeah! That’s how they operate in RGI-land, fly! Didn’t you know that?!? 🙂 ] No, apparently you’re not.

        Again, if you have any integrity whatsoever, you will allow me to respond to your post, and abandon the silly idea of banning anyone.

      • Goodbye, flyonthewall. You’re not serious about this topic. So why bother conversing let alone debating with an obvious troll?

< ——– END OF BROTHA WOLF’S POST AND SUBSEQUENT COMMENTS ——– >


In other words, regarding BW’s last post, he’s tired of not landing a single punch on the flyonthewall. Fly used BW as a rag with which to mop up the kitchen floor and, I guess, BW grew tired of that.

Interestingly, fly was only polite, respectful, nice and way more genteel than the fascistic BW deserved. However, fly made his points, and BW got badly trounced in the exchange. I’ll go back there later to see what else BW and his minions post there. He typically likes to brag that he sure showed that guy! By banning him he showed everyone just how courageous and brave he is. All the while proving only what a cowardly petty, little, small-minded martinet he really is.

A real sheep in wolf’s clothing.

— xPraetorius

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